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/m/ おたく 05/08/2020 (Fri) 16:46:19 No. 855
This is a red-blooded Soviet mech. Say something nice about it!
You're cute, comrade mech. (0///w///0)
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>>855 looks like a frog just finished Eureka 7 and I know not to watch anything else related to the franchise, should I hit up Escaflowne next?
what anime
>>857 Watch Dunbine. >>858 Full Metal Panic! The Savage actually has a good track record on screen, despite being a mook mech.
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すごいです! So is this a mecha thread? I honestly love the design of Gundam Thunderbolt.
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>>860 Does the story ape any of this hack's insipid tropes like most other UC stories?
>>861 In Japan, venting about breaking up with your 5th wife counts as good writing.
fuggin WOMEN amirite? t. tomino :DD
>>1487 men are not real and a capitalist fantasy.
I just realised I've had Gasaraki on my hard drive for over a year and I never got round to watching it. Is it good?
>>865 It's kind of meh. Interesting premise that isn't tapped enough.
>>866 the realest of robots but it's kinda boring imo
>>861 It has a fairly negative view toward war like all of the shit Tomino wrote. It's short and I liked it. May as well check it out.
>>865 It's cool, but not an easy anime to just sit down and watch. Worth watching at some point though.
>>865 I feel like this show's plot was actually making an argument in favor of fascism.
>>870 Really? I thought Takahashi had fairly left-wing political views. I'm only 3 episodes in so far so I can't really say much about Gasaraki yet, but I'm quite liking it. It's not something you can binge watch though.
>>855 >Soviet mech Cringe. Soviet super tanks however.
>>872 LOL Tanks are cool too, post them
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>>855 This is the only soviet mech I respect.
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>>860 Full Armor Gundam and Psycho Zaku are underrated, yes. They both kinda look like they came from Armored Core.
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>>874 What a beauty.
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I uploaded bunch of soviet mechas on the old booru. Also how has no-one mentioned Big O... or Cherno Alpha?
So what's your all's favorite /m/ show?
>>878 The Patlabor movies are absolute kino.
Well, I finished Gasaraki and >>866 was definitely right about how it doesn't get the most out of it's premise. It feels like it was supposed to be longer since it isn't very clear with either it's political thriller or it's spiritual aspects. Maybe I'm just a brainlet and I didn't get it. >>878 I know it's a bit generic, but it's Gundam 0079. i really like the 2004 Testujin and SDF Macross too.
>>878 Gunbuster, SDF Macross, Do You Remember Love, and Patlabor. I know I am forgetting some.
>>855 Strong and rounded like a proper heavy fighter! Mecha is great fun
>>878 Dragon's Heaven, Iria: Zeiram, Casshan: Robot Hunter, Apocalypse Zero, Giant Robo: The Day The Earth Stood Still, Karas, Space Battleship Yamato 2199 I could go on
I think we all know a lot of mecha is little more than trope-riddled soap opera trash designed to sell toys. But disregarding bad plots, what mecha shows have some of the best mechanical porn? The 90s Gundam OVAS are all fantastic in that regard. 08th MS Team is my favorite out of them. The Patlabor movies also come to mind. https://www.invidio.us/watch?v=XHoCPtWaCtw https://www.invidio.us/watch?v=IsMTpSDAGxM For a more controversial statement because >3DCG, I think Majestic Prince had the best mech fights of the past decade.
>>861 >0079 isnt a masterpiece it floors me kids actually skip the most influential and overall high quality mecha anime
Mars Daybreak is under-rated in terms of Mecha
>>1982 The story is complete garbage, the only good thing about it is the animation.
>>1989 >the only good thing about it is the animation lol confirmed for having never watched 0079
>>1991 0079 has actual pathos and purpose to its plot and themes unlike something meaningless like star wars. You're obviously set on not watching it but I implore anyone to give 0079 a full shot. Its last 10 or so episodes especially are some of the greatest moments in all of anime. >>1989 kek
>>1996 >0079 has actual pathos and purpose to its plot and themes <unlike star wars yeah no fuck off.
0079 is actually good but the animation is liquid shit. I can't blame any mechhead for skipping it. The battle choreography in the movies is pretty good, though.
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>>2002 Yeah, the TV show is full of "quality" moments. IIRC this was because their episode director was hospitalized, and so the animation team largely went unsupervised for a couple weeks. Looking back on it, it's actually pretty charming. A lot of people get into mecha for the sakuga but it ain't all that. It's hard to get into the genre if that's all you're looking for, anyway.
>>1989 Lol, the animation is one of the worst aspects of 0079.
>>1991 >>1996 >>1997 >>2002 >>2008 Yep, my bad. Was confusing 0079 with 0083. The animation is actually terrible in the original Gundam. The plot is pretty stupid as well, but I'll refrain from categorizing it as complete fucking shit simply because all the Universal Century shows after it took the worst thing about Tomino's dumb writing in 0079 and turned them into amped up tropes. But it really was just a toy commercial from the beginning.
>>2023 I hate the newtype wank the UC turns into after MSG but imo the ESP shit in the original was alright because it was kinda downplayed until the last episodes. I mean how else are you going to have space opera without breaking the minovsky physics rule of UC? Also why do you think Tomino's writting is dumb? Always eager to read anon's tracts on the old guy.
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>In spite of watching a ton of anime, including LotGH and a bunch of "real mecha" shows, including from Sunrise, I've NEVER actually gotten around to watching ANY Gundam Gundam is the shit. I mean it's the premier mecha series. Only other really good one is Evangelion. But that's just one series and a bunch of add-ons and remakes, and at the end of the day the story doesn't even make sense. Amazing animation though, Hideaki Anno is an autistic genius when it comes to drawing physical-simulation animation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ZL_WVVGbvM Watch War in The Pocket First: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jY8C1gXkeXg Short, amazing animation, strong anti-war message. Although I have my criticisms of Yoshiyuki Tomino. I mean don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good, but at the end of the day, even if you have an anti war message, you create a series celebrating all the bad ass machinery of war, you're still celebrating all the badass machinery of war, you know?
is there any actual left wing gundam or equivalent?
>>2040 >Only other really good one is Evangelion. False. There is Patlabor, Macross, Top wo Nerae, and many others. Watch more mecha.
>>2030 >Also why do you think Tomino's writting is dumb? His characters act like brainless retards (even the adults), and he feels the need to shove some insipid love triangle into fucking every Gundam. Even UC series he had no involvement with felt the need to do this, as if they're paying him some sort of insane tribute.
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>FMP Patrician taste >>879 >Patlabor Speaking of which, here's another Soviet mech. >The Patlabor movies are absolute kino Movie 1? Definitely. The latter two? Nooo. The first Patlabor movie was a textbook example of the right way to do a theatrical film for a long-running OVA/TV anime. It had great animation, good pacing, engaging B-plots, a sophisticated A-plot, good faithful use of the Patlabor cast, and a robot zombie apocalypse finale. Movie 2 was a boring film with a logically and thematically broken dumpster fire of a premise that clumsily marginalized and distorted the Patlabor cast in favor of Oshii's original characters, choked to death on endless interludes of DEEP AND PROFOUND PROSE with the only bright spot its stunningly beautiful (but far too infrequent) animation. Even worse, it was based off "SV2's Longest Day", an underwhelming and silly arc in the OVA that was itself the second of at least three times this plot was tried and failed, after the Appleseed OVA. Fortunately, Oshii FINALLY got it right with GiTS:SAC:2G, the only good, finally perfected execution of this repeatedly failed plot. Now neatly wrapping an existing cast of characters, all in-character, alongside new characters that have coherent sensible motivations for their schemes, with solid political and philosophical themes, and well integrated action scenes. As for the abomination that is WXIII? It took a PARODY EPISODE of the OVA, stretched it to feature length, and and played it DEAD SERIOUS with mawkishness that would be embarassing for a 1950s Toho movie, on top of relegating the Patlabor characters to cameo roles.
>>2063 >Fortunately, Oshii FINALLY got it right with GiTS:SAC:2G Oshii wasn't involved in the television series at all actually, that was all Kenji Kamiyama doing his best to imitate Oshii's style.
>>2065 Ackshually he came back in 2nd GIG: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghost_in_the_Shell:_Stand_Alone_Complex#Production >For the second season, Mamoru Oshii contributed with his ideas to the concept of the entire series and initial planning stages. In an interview, Oshii described his role in 2nd GIG as supervising the entire series and writing the plots for each episode.
>>2068 Wow, didn't know that.
>>2063 is it patlabor good? like I think it has neat designs but I fucking despise cops and I don't know if I can stand up to hours and hours cops simping
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>>2132 >muh acab larp Patlabor is mostly comedic slice-of-life stories rather than an actual action series. Regarding its political tone, I'd describe it as broadly apolitical, with an undertone of wistful leftism. This ties into its major "alternative history" divergence: The advent of mecha as construction equipment for a megaproject of draining Tokyo Bay, in addition to other reconstruction following a disastrous earthquake and looming global warming. This is portrayed as both an inevitable thing in that it's economic growth and a response to environmental decay, and as a bad thing in that it's out-of-control destruction of both the environment and humanity's self-direction. The police in general are portrayed as a peripheral part of society responding primarily to mundane situations, with the protagonists in particular infamous as bumbling clods that often cause as much destruction as they avert from out-of-control mecha, hinting that escalation itself is the greater evil. As for the protagonists as characters, in addition to the occasional terrorist or mobster, they are often at odds with politically motivated higher-ups, business, the military, and intelligence services seeking to use disruptive events to curry power, with the protagonists typically foiling their plans through disinterested slackerdom more than active intervention. Overall, I would describe it as politically similar in tone to GiTS, where the system (read: entire society) they serve is portrayed as obviously corrupt and destructive, but their awareness of this allows the protagonists to make do within it while causing less of that destruction themselves and curbing its worst excesses.
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>>2132 >I fucking despise cops For personal reasons? Or for objective ones? As a class or as individuals? You can empathize with law enforcement and fictional cops without outright being pro-police IRL ya know.
>>2136 >being pro-police The entire idea of moralizing over the pigs is even more inane than pacifism. A future without war and the military is imaginable, a future without some form of policing is not.
>>2041 Left wing in what sense? Iron Blooded Orphans features a gang of lower class colonized hoodrats trying to survive while hounded by space police and importantly there's no super special powers wankery around. I think it might fit the bill even though a lot of gundamtards think it's really bad I liked it Also as >>2040 said, making an anti-war series that also features SUPER COOL MURDER ROBOT BATTLES for 75% of its running time is not possible.
>>2139 >making an anti-war series that also features SUPER COOL MURDER ROBOT BATTLES for 75% of its running time is not possible What about LotGH? By repeatedly pounding in war as a historical waste of precious human potential that could better be spent on anything else, I think it gets across the frivolity of militarism.
>>2041 Fang of the Sun Dougram, Armored Trooper VOTOMs, Blue Comet SPT Layzner, Gargantia on the Verdurous Planet, etc. None of these are explicitly "left wing" but you'll easily notice more pronounced elements throughout their runs. >>2139 Iron Blooded Orphans is bad, actually. S01E14-17 where Tekkadan unknowingly arm a workers uprising on a space colony and Kudelia has a little Macross moment were great, but as far as I'm concerned that's not why most people like the show. No, they like the show because it's got a dull edge, and it's probably the first Gundam they've ever watched. Much like Gundam Wing, it's gonna age poorly, I tell you. Also, Japan's "left wing" has been associated with a loosely defined opposition to militarism and imperialism since the 1960s and 1970s. What little scholarship I've read on otaku subculture tends to point this out, often comparing and contrasting it with the Liberal-Democratic Party's longstanding desire to expand the power and capabilities of the JSDF. Indeed, Japan's "left wing" has grown even more passive with time; the fact that Hayao Miyazaki has remained the face of it in the anime industry is depressing.
>>2141 Is LotGH really even anti-war? It seems to be making a case for Polybius's retarded anacyclosis theory in the end, providing justification massive war and despots.
>>2147 >Iron Blooded Orphans is bad, actually How so, other than "babby's first gendum"?
>>2175 I've watched most of the gundams and I did not find IBO better or worse than the others. It was a bit edgier for sure but that could be good or bad depending on ones tastes. IMO none of the gundams are that good.
>>2201 Yeah that's my exact opinion (although I dig the edge ngl). However when I step on /m/ it's suddenly the worst gundam ever and I don't understand why.
>>2139 Yeah, there's certainly a lot of that cyclical theme in it, but I think this was undercut both by the Alliance having been corrupted primarily by its war with the Empire, and with the story ending on the high note of Reinhardt conceding on the Empire as a transitional instrument toward something more democratic after wiping away all traces of the rot from the Goldenbaum Dynasty's reign. This was on top of the overwhelmingly negative portrayal of war, both in the implied "author's voice" of horrific carnage onscreen and the death or diversion of brilliant people into something unproductive, as well as directly in the words of the heroes (especially both Yang and Reinhardt) describing war as humanity's folly. Not to mention that even the Greeks and their successors who held the theory typically viewed it not as inevitable, let alone good, but as a historical trend, something they hoped could be stopped with usually some dumb hybrid regime like "muh philosopher kangz", but still a truly new political system. Outright belief in misery and discord for its own sake as inherent virtue in human affairs is a very unusual stance, peculiar to retarded ideologies such as certain strains of fascism or Catholicism.
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>>2223 A lot of people on /m/ who think IBO is bad (including myself to some extent) wished it were edgier. Mikazuki fits the ideal protagonist they've conjured up in their heads, where he just fucks shit up with no fear or remorse, but the show rarely depicts that in satisfying ways. I personally wouldn't have minded that if the martian independence stuff dealt more with interplanetary class struggle opposing the reconstitution of chattel slavery or some shit but the show doesn't really do that either. The writing is wishy-washy. I love the premise of no beam spam, as well as the mechanical designs (which is also a controversial take on /m/, apparently), but for me it was just a slog to get through. Given the aftermath of the Calamity War and there supposedly being a total of 72 Gundam Frames in the canon, Sunrise probably would've been better off making it an OVA series like Thunderbolt.
Oops, >>2228 was meant for >>2162
Critical support for Zeon for their fight against space imperialism.
>>2360 >Zeon is a bunch of literal space nazis >AEUG is financed by a bunch of opportunist porkies >Anaheim is stupidly corrupt and >the nationalized SNRI produces the best mass produced gundam in the entire UC (formula and silhouette series), Anaheim cannot compete with them ever again Nah the feds are based, fuck off zeke scum.
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>>2365 >tfw no alternate universe show where Zeon Zum Deikun lives, ensures Side 3's commitment to Newtype Socialism, and has the Zabi family executed Romanov style
>>2053 >His characters act like brainless retards (even the adults) I used to think this till I realised he's just allergic to having characters with clear stated intentions or thoughts and instead has them contradicting themselves and having internal logic that you have to really pay attention to to catch but IS fairly consistent. Is that good writing? Maybe not but it's certainly a unique style that makes his characters feel more interesting than most anime. >and he feels the need to shove some insipid love triangle into fucking every Gundam Never seen this complaint before so maybe that's a personal hangup of yours. >>2063 Oh shit it's 'hates patlabor movie 2' anon. FYI to those who haven't seen it it's a generally beloved film, basically apocalypse now but good. Only the third movie is actually shit.
Is Darling in the Franxx any good?
>>2580 No.
>>2590 explicate
>>2591 It's a shitty rip-off of Evangelion with bits of Gundam thrown in, If you check the old leftyweebpol thread on evangelion you'll see a whole rant explaining this.
>>2591 Asides from this >>2592, the MC is just plainly generic. Shinji works because he's obviously designed for his role and looks the part for a fish out of water. Whatever-the-fuck-was-his-name-is looks like an isekai protagonist. So, when I hear his bitching, it's just ear-grating. His sadness is not at all subtle or nuanced, it is melodramatic. The same melodramatic, overacted bullshit that's typical of modern anime. Save for Zero Two, the rest of the cast is one-note. You may have seen them somewhere before in a different anime, because they're cut and dry archetypes. In general, the show is just painfully generic despite being helmed in part by TRIGGER. Not that TRIGGER is hot shit. Darling in The FranXX is another entry in their catalogue of Eva/mecha "homages", but their in-your-face energy takes a backseat to the least interesting parts of the anime. I would blame Clover for this if not for the fact that TRIGGER allowed this to happen. They smelled money, and whatever was conjured up in the production committee succeeded in spades. Darling in the Franxx was really fucking popular. Zero Two carries the entirety of the show, hands down. No other character is interesting as her. And, no other character clearly upsets the dynamic of the copy-paste cast of characters other than her. She is the catalyst which drives the plot. Which is a tad sad, because the rest of the cast could have been more. There is this one episode "BoysXGirls" that really has fun with the group dynamic by driving a juvenile wedge between the boys and girls. The premise is simple: the girls have one side of the house and the boys have the other side of the house. What ensues is chaos that draws out every characters reaction to the absurd & childish feud. It's probably the best episode I could ask for in a show that I genuinely just didn't enjoy at all.
>>2595 >muh characters Don't listen to these autists >>2580 Darling in the Franxx is worth watching.
>>2601 >worth watching If you're a brainlet who only wants to mindlessly consume cutesy colorful content with muddled ideological rubbish ripped-off of much better predecessors.
>>2592 >rip-off of Evangelion Man, remember when those were all the rage? Probably the most blatant specimen was RahXephon, filled with storyboard-level plagiarism onscreen, and a story that comes off as an amateurish fix-fic at best.
>>2601 >>muh characters The show is a character drama. If it fails at that, what's the point? I definitely didn't find the plot interesting. The fighting scenes were pretty cool, I guess.
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>>2607 Also Full Metal Panic! though perhaps not exactly /m/. The heroes' sub was built using a partly constructed USSR prototype, a hypothetical continuation of real-world amphibious assault submarines designed by the USSR from WWII to the '70s, except in FMP's world continued clear into the '80s: >TDD-1 finds its origins in the failed USSR ballistic missile submarine development project designated Project 985. >Project 985 was begun in the late 1980s as a refined form of a transport submarine project of the 1970s. If completed, its size of 180 meters would have made it the largest submarine ever, larger than the Typhoon Class ballistic missile submarine. In the political turmoil of the early 1990s, the project was met with budget shortfalls and difficulty obtaining construction materials. The incomplete vessel was left untouched for 14 months, as workers and engineers failed to receive pay. >The military decided Project 985 would never reach completion under the prevailing economic and political circumstances, and canceled construction. The incomplete vessel was towed to the Arctic seas where it was scuttled and sunk to a depth of several thousand metres. >The naval intelligence community of the western democratic nations used this as an example of the flawed Soviet naval doctrine. Plan 985 was derisively called a "toy box", an obviously unrealistic and childishly optimistic design proving its lack of worth by its cancellation. >In the following years, several rumors surfaced postulating the possibility of the vessel being purchased by and covertly handed to the Chinese government. The CIA and the United States Navy have discounted these theories as fanciful conjecture and fiction. >Mithril somehow obtained the incomplete vessel to redesign and complete construction at Merida Island, beginning in late 1993. In efforts to incorporate exceedingly advanced technologies and maintaining secrecy proved to be extremely expensive. Its construction costs is estimated to be 5 to 6 times the projected cost for completing Project 985. Incorporating several advanced Black Technology systems, the ship was designed and constructed largely between Teletha Testarossa and Retired Royal Navy Captain Richard Mardukas. On an amusing sidenote, in FMP's backstory the course of the Cold War ended up inverted, with the USSR winning the Afghan War and continuing unperturbed after Gorbechov was assassinated, meanwhile China fell back into civil war in the '90s.
Oops, didn't mean to reply to that last post, meant that for OP.
Voltron is mecha right? Can anyone give me a quick rundown on what's worth watching? I've heard Voltron: Legendary Defender was decent but a lot of 'filler' was dedicated to teasing various ships and other stuff.
I'm currently watching ZZ Gundam and I feel like there's always one element of the show that holds it back for me. The first arc of the show I enjoyed, comedy and all. However, the treatment of Fa was hilariously abysmal. It's like someone on the writing team actually hated her or something. Then once Fa was written off it was cool, but puru puru newtype girl shows up taking baths and shit
>>2611 Didn't the creator of Full Metal Panic die in the KyoAni fire?
>>2938 He's still alive it appears. According to wikipedia he hates Greta Thunberg and fantasizes about making her eat steak lol.
>>2918 I started watching it yesterday, it has a totally different tone but it's interesting, it builds something different in the gundam universe I think
>>2918 >puru puru newtype girl puru is best little sister dont @ me
>>2918 yeah, Fa in Zeta was a better pilot, is looks like they held her back to show off Judeau, how they "writted her off" makes sense but it feels they wanted to remove any continuity to Zeta other than the children and a bunch of not-so important crew members of the Argama and out-of-character Bright, it's a good show and changing mood from the gritty-nes of Zeta is not a bad idea but it feels like a bad sequel.
>it's a good show Zeta and ZZ are both fucking trash.
>>3132 Wrong.
>>3134 Wrong.
>>3136 This
>>3132 why is Zeta trash? I didn't like how it went after the first half but I woudln't call it trash, but 0079 is still miles better than everything else (except 0080)
>>3132 go watch your SAO and leave Tomino chads be
>>3140 Repeats all the terrible character writing of the first show which ZZ then happily regurgitates.
>>3142 >I don't like the writing in the second show because it has the same writing as the first show which has the same writing as the third show wow gee, mr.psued, its almost like they're all made by the same guy
>>2987 /based/
>>3159 Indeed, that's how we know he's a giant hack.
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what is it about this man that inspires such animosity in zoomers
>>3163 >make decent setting >make decent anti-war story >characters persist against overwhelming odds and despair PSYCHIC TEENAGERS
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>>3165 >PSYCHIC TEENAGERS This is the best part of the show, yes.
>>3167 Wasted opportunity. He could have made Lala based on Lakshmi Sahgal, she served in the Japaneses backed Indian National Army, fighting against the allied forces in WWII, after the war she joined the CPI. The story could explore the tension between collaborating with a fascist invader and fighting against colonialism for national liberation. Assuming, of course, that global south countries UC0079 were still subjects of the EF government, later UC Gundam works seem to imply that this was the case. No need to make Lala some psychic child prostitute exploited for her power. Instead, for example, Zeon could be exploiting oppressed locals as troops to boost their numbers and offering national self determination after the war in exchange.
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>>3183 >he should have made an entirely different show with a way more serious and explicit political/historical focus than would have ever been allowed on a telivision anime in the 70s with a shortened runtime and 20 minute episodes Are you a retard as well as a psued? Are you even aware of the historical precedent that 0079 set for anime? Are you aware Tomino literally invented the genre of mecha being weapons for actual war rather than just toy commercials for kids with plots attached? That he was 10 years ahead of his time? Do you realise this is an anime board and you are talking about a robot anime from the 70s? The absolute fuck is wrong with zoomers.
>>3184 >The absolute fuck is wrong with zoomers. capitalism
>>3183 >Assuming, of course, that global south countries UC0079 were still subjects of the EF government, later UC Gundam works seem to imply that this was the case. yeah, they are still subjected to western imperialism, ZZ has a story arc about this too.
>>3184 to be fair 0079 is the most political explicit gundam, they later loose all the nuances, ZZ brought some stuff back like >>3188 but it got lost later on, modern stuff like 00 have made up countries and the protagonists work for a "benevolent private company" called Celestial Being, it's very cringe and it's a shame because the first five minutes were pretty promosing from this pov, I still have to watch IBO tho, I hope modern gundam can still offer something.
>>3189 and with "benevolent" I mean like they pursue peace and that's just it, it was not to suggest anyting shady, just pure liberal idealism.
>>3189 Gundam has interesting politics but its just window dressing much like the mecha and fights. Its always been about interpersonal conflict between the characters. Amuro's growth as a soldier and an adult. Bright dealing with being the newb captain of a ship full of children. Kai taking shit seriously. Char obsessing over his rivalry and losing sight of his revenge etc etc. What's misunderstood about tomino shows (and I feel his success at this varies wildly) is the characters move inspite of the plot. Not the other way around. >is the most political explicit gundam I guess I agree but its really just that one hitler line you're thinking of, isn't it? I always thought the background politics in zeta were way more interesting. Seeing the corrupt federation fall to a fascist coup is pretty interesting compared to allies v. nazis but in space. Also yeah thats what I've heard about 00. I don't really care about gundam without tomino personally. It's his franchise whether they publish fanfiction like Unicorn or not. I'd rather watch one of the several takahashi shows I've yet to watch if I want more mecha shit.
>>3192 obviously the focus is on characters and the general anti-war message but 0079 setted all the political worldbuilding, it just not the hitler line or Zeon using the german iron cross and the rising sun as insigna but the portrayal of the federation as an imperialist power that exploits the space colonies, that are literal colonies of them, Amuro gets called privileged by Kai for being Canadian! also the darker portrayal of the ESFS begun in 0079, the behavior of their troops in Amuro's home town totally remembered what I read and know from my grandma of USA's military occupation in my region and I really felt that, so while Zeta does interesting stuff with the Titans (which was obviously a great development that I really liked) which I also find ahead of their times, I already say that aspect already laid out in 0079 and later flahsed out in Zeta and if I may go hard on Zeta, without even getting anywhere interesting because we get a stereotypical evil jupiter space man as the later villain of the series, stripping it out of every political tone it had by that point.
>>3197 You're right that part of the setting is that the earth is portrayed as the "elites" while the spacenoids were basically the poor pushed into colonies to deal with overpopulation. I actually always thought it was a mistep that the series didn't do more to show that Zeon was subverting a genuine want for liberation in the spacenoid population. You have a few lines from Sayla and Kai but that really isn't much. I recall Zeta doing more to layout the conflict between earth/spacenoids than 0079 did in its short runtime with Char criticizing the federation while fighting the explicitly bigoted titan faction as well as giving us a whole speach on his father and spacenoids etc. I really don't agree about the political complaints with Zeta. It is consistent in that the politics are mostly a contrivance for the character interactions from start to finish. That sciroco was a backstabbing ladder climber in the fascist faction doesn't really change that. Idk man maybe read some historical fiction like For Whom the Bell Tolls or something if you want your stories to have a really well developed political setting.
>>3198 yeah, ZZ did it at the end but it had more potential to work with, but again I'd say the concept is for sure laid out in 0079 too, first they tell you about the actual Zeon revolution by Ramba Ral's (but at that point you think it's just a fascist "revolution) but tthen you connect the dots about truths when you get to know about the Zabi's counter-revolution by Sayla's and Casval's confrontation at the Texas Colony. About Zeta, I think it peaked in both its political context and in the anime itself with the Dakar conference, I felt saddened when it got mostly all about Scirocco's personal ambitions and when basically everyone (even him) forgots that Quattro promised to stop hiding and being Char again, and in name too, but then he is still Lt. Quattro for anyone. TL;DR: I have my issues with the latter arc of Zeta and I find 0079 (the movies at least) more solid and offering every political themes fleshed out in the UC. PS: I'm really grateful for your raccomandation and I will check it for sure, thanks really.
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Interesting post I read. Silurio1 [S] 7 points 10 days ago* Robotech (Macross, kinda), reached my country in 1987, during the worst year for human rights in Chile since 1975. It was aired in "Canal 13", a right wing corporate TV channel, one of the 4 we had. I was only 2 back then, but it was rerun a bunch of times. So I grew up with it. I quite liked it, even tho I didn't quite get the story or continuity, since I could only watch one or two from the 5 episodes aired every week. I even had the collectable album. Decades later I was watching "Do you remember love" when I read "Santiago" (the name of my city) in the Macross city cinema. So I paused, read and googled. It was the documentary, "Il pleut sur Santiago". "It rains over Santiago", a documentary about the 1973 coup by Pinochet. It still makes me tear up, to think that the makers of a beloved show from my childhood were thinking about us when making this movie, eleven years after the fact. That half a world away, they still in their hearts felt the need to denounce the atrocities my people were suffering.
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Is Zeon the Soviet Union or Nazi Germany? How much did the cold war influence Mobile Suit Gundam 0079? I've heard people argue for both sides though the common argument is that they were Nazis. The previous answers I received before being told to take this here were the following >sieg zeon >heil zeon >that flag Zeon during OYW = Nazi Germany Neo Zeon = generic opportunistic fascists Neo Zeon under Char = https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WXSkaSkVBYA
I noticed in GunBuster Episode 5 there is a calendar for 2021 that has Van Halen on it... it's a little sad he didn't live to 2021.
Maybe it's just me, but Gunbuster is a very under-rated show from what I've seen. As in people list it as a good anime, but only in passing, with little to say about it. For me, I have a hard time putting into words its impact on me. The small flaws of the compact OVA are irrelevant to the major details that really resonated. That bitter-sweet ending of the last episode made me feel a want to shed a tear for real, and I had a strange ache in my heart, that only worsened the more I thought about the idea of knowing that everyone you've ever known has been gone for 12 millenia... While NGE is in many ways Anno's most prominent work, in a less depressive and edgy regard, Gunbuster has given me similar self-reflection and simple but deep feelings in even less time.
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>>876 >>874 Is Jung Freud /ourmuse/?
>>2918 Same anon, here I finished it and enjoyed it quite a bit more than I did earlier. My criticisms of Fa/Puru still stand, but after a certain story beat, I think Puru became a better character. Everything on Earth was thoroughly enjoyable, especially the Dublin arc Wish I had more closure on Kamille but I am satisfied enough with what was shown
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I'm kinda in the mood to moan about *pr*s*ng again. Would that be cool here?
>>4935 >*pr*s*ng What the heck is that?
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>>4943 Y'know. The sequel.
>>4952 Ohhhh ok, jeez, I thought it was some code word or some shit. Yeah, go ahead, talk about that shitshow all you like, I'll even join in, it's on topic for sure.
>>4935 Even though technically the physics of Pacific Rim aren't totally correct, (this is mecha so that's not the biggest concern) The way it was animated and shot made you really FEEL the gargantuan motions of those robots and the impacts against flesh and bone. The plot and acting were cheesy but it fit the genre and I really enjoyed it. The sequel was shit, and the only good part was some cool robots and monsters, which is barely anything in a whole bucket of idiocy. It really lacks the same feel of the first film (probably cause Del Toro wasn't involved).
>>4964 >>4935 Just to add, my only complaint about Pacific Rim is that Cherno Alpha got torn apart so easily and didn't even use it's huge nuclear flamethrowers or seriously damage Otachi.
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I guess the reason I still think about Uprising is because of the tiny bits of good (animation & design wise) it had which only encourages me to think up of a better sequel while still keeping the bits I like. I haven't even seen it again, beginning to end, since it came out so my memory might fail me. Anyway, I think the VR simulation scuffle is a good scene to work through my thoughts. At your own risk: https://youtu.be/qrMn80ARkoE >lighting - gif #1 So, yeah, Onibaba actually looks great here under broad daylight. The other kaiju do too, for the most part. I'd say this is by far the most positive thing Uprising managed to achieve. The warm light is perfectly contrasted with shadows dark enough to obscure some of the kaiju's details. I'm no artist but I think strong shadows are important to sell not only how "real" it looks, but also the scale. On the other hand, the jaegers look kinda iffy. The main jaegers tend to be overly glossy and look washed out under harsher light. Titan Redeemer looks good though in the 3rd gif. I think the warmer light helps. There were also some lighting changes between the first trailer and final product that I might get to in another post. >the big problem, or, 2fast 0furious - gif #2 The next thing to notice after how nice the crab looks is just how quickly this otherwise good shot moved to the next. Compare that to the original which lingers, inviting us to appreciate and digest what is on screen. Also note how the glancing morning star immediately cuts to Titan closing in without any moment in between. There are other king crimson cuts like this which just ruins the flow. It's not simply that "they move faster". Everything is faster. The more stylised camera would actually be interesting to see if not for the fact that it's combined with the already faster movement, quicker shots and snappier cuts which btw also likes to cut to conn-pod scenes which are almost, if not equally, as long as the now shorter snippets of combat in between thanks to the faster speed. In contrast, the first film had them sandwiched between longer scenes of fighting, there's less empty dialogue and the conn-pods are actually interesting to look at! See the Knifehead webm for example. >>4935 >weight - gif #3 This is such a cool little moment it honestly makes me sad. Why is this not the standard? Lighting and "physics" are on point. Inertia in action as Titan buckles and shakes when Onibaba intercepts the blow. There are probably other details like this in the movie if you look hard enough but they're still subdued by the above issues. Too few and far in between and are easily missed due to everything being faster and them being less prominent. I do feel like the animators were trying, but like the way they tried to establish scale, they ultimately failed to achieve the same sense of weight and scale that graced the setpieces of the first. The hits lack the punch you'd expect (that flaccid elbow rocket...) and jaegers even get thrown around like ragdolls a couple of times by normal sized kaiju. There's no longer any interest to focus on the working of pistons, locking of joints and shifting of plates which is completely antithethical to the original design philosophy. Where are the closeups of weapons and transformations? WHERE'S THE FUCKING LAUNCH SEQUENCE? >jaegers moving too organically - gif #4 Another factor that compounds the weight issue. Looking at the gif, the problem isn't really Titan's speed. It's how smooth it looks as it gingerly twists its hips to provide power to the weapon. There's always a bit of "weightlessness" before a hit connects, I think, but you'd expect at least some hint of mechanisms locking and shifting. Even if there were though, Uprising's editing style would just bury that detail. The jaegers almost look like they copy the pilots 1:1. This makes no sense inside and outside the context of the movie. Why would you animate/design jaegers to copy the pilot's every flinch, fumble or other useless and potentially harmful movements? Outside the story, the jaegers just end up moving too organically to give them that mechanical feel and weight the original jaegers had. There has always been some disconnect between the pilots and the jaegers themselves. Eliminating that is basically shooting yourself in the foot. >where's my kaiju fisticuffs? There's seemingly an aversion to any sort of drawn out close combat between kaiju and jaegers this time around. Maybe because it would be too "boring" or "repetitive"? So then what did we get with the 4v3 in Tokyo? Kaiju gets flattened repeatedly by buildings while jaeger runs away. Kaiju gets kicked repeatedly and runs away. Kaiju shoots spikes but gets shot at back and...runs away. There's barely any sense of danger until mega kaiju and by that point, jaegers are virtually useless so they just divebomb it. I get more of a rush just watching that 3rd gif. A perfectly usable kaiju team wasted. Shrikethorn harassing jaegers with its javelins before slinking in between buildings for cover. Hakuja using both it's digging and climbing skills to ensnare and suprise jaegers from below and above. Raijin is obviously a tank, handling two jaegers with its protective abilities wouldn't be a stretch. Remove mega kaiju since it's a useless gimmick and devote that time to these three. Just imagine. >sound design Alright, whatever happened here was downright cursed. Mechanical sounds are mostly superseded by digital ones. GRRRRRRR-Kshnk is now vrrrrrr beep boop. Especially the weapons, from swords popping out to missiles being launched. Seriously though, what's up with that new plasmacaster? Gipsy Danger's had that understated and satisfying dink which was perfectly complemented by the rippling and bubbling of vaporising flesh. The new one is literally just loud noise. That weird filter for the pilot helmets is dumb too. The weak selection of sfx brings the whole thing even further down. Weak looking hits sound even weaker. All that said, I think the kaiju roars are fine. Pacific Rim wasn't only a treat to look at, but to listen to as well. All those powerful and immersive sounds arranged meticulously which points our attention to specific things at specific times while not drowning each other out or the music. Maybe I'm not remembering correctly but I think there were parts in Uprising where the audio mixing is just bad, like sections where the music gets drowned out by the action, some of which I actually like after giving them a listen. I might have to check myself but, eh. I'm out of steam.
>>4981 This is an excellent effort-rant about that movie. I applaud this and will give it more attention when I've got the time.
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>>4982 I feel like I could add a bit more but, eh. It's always been hard for me to describe what makes the "Jaeger" look, what with all the variety coming from different generations and places. But if there's a word I'd choose, it'd be: Solid. Made to take, and give, beatings. There's a wonderful marriage of curved and flat surfaces in most of them. Even Cherno, which can be described as taped-together boxes, has its prominent cooling tower ushanka and incinerator tubes. In the strangest way, I feel it also helps with the sense of scale since one can't help but think: "Damn, that thing is so huge there's bound to be both kinds of shapes all over it," if that makes any sense. There are a few designs in Uprising that I either like or at least think can be easily improved. I'll start with... >Bracer Phoenix This falls into the latter. The image of the HG plamo from that particular angle with some more basically sums up what it could've been. Instead of the short, pudgy thing it actually is, the flattering angle turns it into a tall and imposing wall. The changes would be: >shorter pauldrons so the edges would be more flush with the upper arm, also to ease up on the downward slope >slightly thinner (less wide) chest >thicker, longer abdomen/waist that doesn't look like it's going to snap >also maybe lose the chicken legs for straighter ones. maybe longer or just an overall size increase so it wouldn't be dwarfed. With it's visor, collar and thick forearms, I think it looks a bit like a heavier, more armoured cousin of Gipsy. It manages to attain some of the look without being as blatant a successor as Avenger. Perhaps there's some potential in that? There's also an unused concept of a third chest gun that links with the other two as a minigun. Utilising this would've solidified its image as an unyielding mobile artillery platform that turns to rocket-boosted knuckler dusters when things get too hot. I'm tempted to imagine a drawn-out, long-range engagement between Shrikethorn and the improved BP. One, a skirmisher that pellets the jaegers before quickly finding cover while the other, a striding blaze of cannons and missiles. >Titan Redeemer The more I look, the more I like it. This concept art and the Onibaba gif in particular. The broad yet smooth shoulders are strangely pleasing and create a unique silhouette. I much prefer Titan's way of having prominent shoulders compared to BP's. It's like there's a thing going on with them in Uprising, huh? The panels at the top of the head look kind of like slicked back hair or dreads, and the conn-pod reminds me more of a face statue or mask rather than some sort of helmet. With its signature flail, the entire thing makes me think of a golem or mythical statue given life. Bionicle? Shame it's only a background jaeger. If we were to take the BP-as-full-armour-gipsy route, I'd like to see Titan as a main. >Guardian Bravo I can't hate this guy. I can see why one would call it generic or boring, but the feeling I get is "old-school", and not even old-school jaeger but old-school mecha. The colours and those thingies that peek from the back remind me especially of Robot Jox. There's a real heroic sense to it's design. The weakest areas I'd say are the midsection and parts of the shoulders and forearms that stick way too up and out. The best parts are definitely its legs and stompy feet. I don't like the whips though. Doesn't seem like anything that could kill a kaiju. Personally, I think hand-held weapons don't really fit jaegers. Partly due to their size, but also I feel that they don't really click aesthetically. Hard to explain. Jaegers mesh better with integrated and transforming weapons, like Gipsy's plasmacaster, Striker's chest missiles and CT's saws. Also, no chance of dropping them. >Obsidian Fury Best design and probably best thing to come out of Uprising, by far. I love this thing as much as the originals. Tall, lean and sleek as hell. Very humanoid and smooth all over with futuristic linings on its surface. Colder and more arrogant than Striker could hope to be. I don't know what more to say. Really, there are more words I can dedicate on how unfortunate this design with incredible potential had to be wasted on Uprising. Seriously, even without Del Toro's directing, Obsidian should have been the main villain from beginning to end. I feel it could've easily been some sort of top of the line, next-gen super mecha (mark vii?) that gets jaegerjacked instead of Newt's secret project. Its design would work as both a menacing villain and a representation of how far J-tech has come. The whole package gives it the impression of ruthless efficiency and cunning. It would be a foil to the kaiju's honest brutality and a sign of the precursors' true intelligence. An agent of disruption and sabotage, later acting as shepherd and steward to the newly arrived kaiju. Now that would've been something.
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Question, would Toku related discussion be appropriate in this thread or does it warrant a separate thread?
>>5158 toku is /m/; don't let anyone tell you otherwise
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>>5087 >>4981 This really sums up how I feel about Uprising, especially how the Jaegers were less mechanical than the first. The first one had maybe more *roughness* attached to it that really did it for me. I might need to give it another shot though
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Are ya ready for more? So, a thing I don't really see other people talk about Uprising is the lighting change. I noticed the daylight scenes in the first trailer are not as bright as in the final product, with darker shadows and less glare. Some Sydney and Tokyo scenes in particular featured a warmer, yellowish glow rather than the harsher white glare seen in the release version. They seem to have been done away with by the second trailer. Even scenes that were otherwise unchanged like the kaiju group shot look slightly brighter from that point on. Whether these were placeholders/WIP and changes were already set or only made after the 1st trailer, I don't know. But in general, I think the changes only served for the worse. >comparison #1 - first missile barrage It really sucks that Obsidian got the short end of the stick again. The short time it had is also marred by this strange decision the change the, imo, already good lighting. Among other things, there's a clear decision to make its panel linings more obvious which isn't necessarily a bad thing, but the final result ends up making Obsidian look either too glossy, too washed out or worse, both. I really like the impression you get from the old one. The highlighted areas are nowhere near the level of the revamp but still reveal bits of OF's surface detail. The shadows are dark, hiding the details and reducing most of its physique into a deep silhouette even under sunlight. This along with the lower glare, I feel, makes the orange lights dotting its form pop out more. It's a cool aesthetic for a villain. >comparison #2 - chainsaw reveal Obsidian also gets too glossy at times as I mentioned. It's actually worse in the ensuing fight, but it's already somewhat evident here. The old one acfually has a bit of gloss too, but manages to pull it off more convincingly. I think it's the general brightness increase, more obvious surface detail and mirror polish that don't really work together, making it look uncanny at times. Another thing is the changed animation which I feel made the moment weaker. But it's not only a visual issue. The cursed sound design means the saws pop out with those digital noises that really confuses my ears. In the original however, the more decisive gesture of pulling out both saws at the same time was also accompanied by a pretty solid SHNK. It might've been sfx added for the trailer, but it works.
>>5165 >comparison #3 - siberia This is also a multi-layered comparison since not only is the lighting different, but so is the location of the later half of Obsidian's final fight. I think both the old and new starts the same since both began with a heavier blizzard and a mountain in the background. After the chasm drop (first appeared in 2nd trailer) however, the new one transitions into a brighter, sun-lit sky and the old one's mountain is replaced with ice cliffs stretching into the horizon. Again, the change follows the "make it brighter" mentality. It's not as bad a change though for this particular moment. The rest of the fight is another matter. Still, I prefer the older iteration. The cloudy sky isn't as bright and a blue hue saturates the scene while white yet again dominates the new one. The mountain is not only more visually interesting, but I think also works better for a sense of scale. There's ice chunks scattered about which I'm not sure it'd work but again: scale and visually interesting. Am I crazy for thinking the more visible clouds help too? Which brings me to another thing lost from the first movie: the relationship between mood and weather. This version actually looks dire and gloomy even without the help of rain, the night or a blizzard. Obsidian still retains the "dark silhouette" quality in the old version, with the orange lights adding a bit of detail. Otherwise, both jaegers still have some reflective sheen without it being overdone. There's a neat moment where the sparks light up OF's surface detail for a split second which no longer happens with how bright the new one is. The bits of metal flying off look nice too and I have no idea why they're removed. Oh, and there's also Gipsy's searchlights barely shining through the air.
>>5165 >Are ya ready for more? Yes! Epice Uprising breakdowns are kino AF
>>5159 Cool beans, I guess I will start the toku train by shilling Kamen Rider Kuuga. Please folks, you can stream it for free and it is certified kino
>>4148 The amount of fanwank about CCA and Char's intentions in that movie easily drowns out the works of Marx and Engels in sheer quantity of text on the internet. I personally go with the suicide by cop + homo-rivalry theory. "Amuro I'm about to do something extremely wicked" and all that. About 0079, I don't think the cold war influenced much of it and imo it's like Tomino tried to do a straight WWII story but in space. Zeon is clearly the Axis meanwhile the EF is the allies, the soviet influence in the last one is more diluted but they included several memes like human (GM) wave attacks and the EFSF using red and gold as their color scheme. The neutral colonies like Side 7 were sort of analog to the colonial war torn countries like China but that's much much more diluted. >>4158 Do you agree with the analysis that Gunbuster is kinda a masturbatory japanazi fantasy? I remember somebody on /leftyweebpol/ posting this article about it and it really made me think: https://animekritik.wordpress.com/2011/11/22/imperialism-translation-gunbuster-introduction/
>>5175 >japanazi I really don't see how TBH. If anything the situation of Gunbuster's world is that of collectivization and elimination of capitalist extremities outside of some mild hobby-commodities (music, toys, clothes etc.). The story is that of self-sacrifice for a greater cause, with the ending being bittersweet as they survive but everyone and everything they knew, loved and hated are dead and gone The vague Okinawa references are just references to the Japanese recent past and does very little to project any ideas of nationalism. That's like saying a film with sets in Berlin and portraying the Reichstag is a Germanazi fantasy.
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>>5175 >>5178 Epic blogpost guy is overreaching hard for the fun of it but anno was definitely influenced by growing up watching the animes of hardcore nationalists like leiji matsumoto and probably absorbing imperial japanese fetishism. I mean japan literally took over the world in gunbuster lol. Its hard to say gunbuster itself is nationalistic though since the time dialation and impossible odds and mecha wank are way more important than the setting which is barely relevant other than being a near future earth. (Plus anno apologised!) Its funny what an opposite to Leiji that Tomino seems to be on this front seeing as he is another big anime name that anno has sucked off throughout his career. In the anime+movie Ideon the bad guys are an almost rediculously overt parody of imperial japan eg. constantly referring to themselves as samurai, waxing about honor, war crimes out the wazoo, an entire episode where a commander forces his soldiers to kamikaze the enemy with promises of honor for their families only to pussy out when confronted with the enemy himself. Hell if not for Tomino constantly shitting on tribalism maybe young otaku anno would have grown up into an imperialist apologist like the attack on titan guy. On that note everyone should watch Ideon, its the best.
>>5216 >an imperialist apologist like the attack on titan guy I'm still not buying it, the theme of Attack on Titan seems to change every six months. The only constant seems to be the endless carnage.
>>5221 >the theme of Attack on Titan seems to change every six months I don't read/watch shonen. I'm referring to things the mangaka has said online about japan's occupation of korea.
>>5222 I wouldn't really categorize Attack on Titan as shonen.
>>5223 Well I don't wanna be pedantic but it seems to be sold as a shonen. If its the gore thats confusing you then that Bleach show got pretty gorey too. Hell fotns was a shonen jump series back in the day iirc.
>>5223 On a side note, a single decently large mecha would basically turn the tide in Attack on Titan with ease. A basic Gundam would probably handle almost all but the armored and colossal titans.
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>>5169 Something I forgot to add. One of the bits I remember from Del Toro's commentary track is the idea of creating different levels of colour and light to create scale. I think it came up during Gipsy vs. Leatherback. That scene had the surface level be saturated with the warm orange of the dock lights and the night sky overhead in cooler blacks and blues. I think it's present in old Siberia too albeit in a subtler fashion. Most of the sunlight is focused on the cracks between clouds while the rest of the scene is enveloped by the shade. The release version is lit too well and evenly above and below to achieve this effect. I also love the streaks of reflected light on the ice surface in the old version. Not something we'd be able to appreciate in real time, but it does make for a pretty wallpaper. All in all, using proto-Siberia as a general lesson, we have: >placing quantifiable elements in background and foreground for scale >having different levels of colour/light for scale >purposeful usage of weather and lighting to create appropriate atmosphere Emphasis on the last one especially during the day.
>>5234 >creating different levels of colour and light to create scale We see this really well in the initial Gipsy-Danger vs Knifehead fight as well.
>>5216 Could I replace watching the series for the first movie "A contact"? I'm really short of time and Ideon has been on my watchlist for a literal decade lol.
>>5249 No, it's not like the Gundam 0079 movies. It compresses the story too much and you won't be able to make sense of the plot. Ideon is a bit padded in the middle, but you really need to watch the series to appreciate Be Invoked.
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>>5234 >comparison #4 - the pose Yet again, warmer colours traded for more brightness. I'd say the new one still looks good. An example of how the bright white can work. I think the trick lies in making it glint and shine without making it glossy. The battle damage looks nice and adds another layer of detail. I love the old one though. The morning/evening look and gentler shade that doesn't completely obscure sets a strangely positive mood. Comfy, even. >comparison #5 - group shot Not exactly the most well-regarded moment in either case. But new the excessive filter just drowns out the other jaegers' colours and the highly reduced shadows make it that extra video gamey. I like how the original had Gipsy mostly shadowed. It's interesting at least. I also found an edit which further darkened it. >>5235 Can't understate how important the wonderfully done water effects are too. The waterline practically acts as a divider and the water physics add to the sense of scale similarly to how the movements of the jaegers do. The Knifehead fight is visually the most raw and dour. The only sources of light are Gipsy's searchlights and the occasional lightning under the midnight storm. There's no music for the first half either. Great tone setter. It really drives home that the common emotion when facing a kaiju is pants-shitting terror, even with a jaeger. Whatever bravado Raleigh had is gone by the time he's begging his brother to shoot it dead. The most "fun" the movie got was when Gipsy arrived in Hong Kong. The arenas brightened up considerably, first with the blues and oranges of Leatherback and then the neon lights of Otachi. The earlier double event moved up from Knifehead through the addition of distant lights from the background cityscape. The final battle is lit by searchlights, vents, the trench and Breach itself. Darker, but still colourful. Whatever one can moan about "night" or "rain", there are unique qualities within each scene. There is variety even with the thematic constant of darkness and water. A variety that is strangely missing in Uprising, given how much freedom it had. I don't feel there's much to celebrate about daylight when they end up being the same shade of noon and the setpieces themselves already suffering from other problems. Not a striking sunrise or sunset. Not even the gloomy, cloudy Siberia made it. The way I see it, the first film used the night as a means to play around with light. Is it not the point then, that the day should be an opportunity to experiment with darkness?
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>>1751 >Giant Robo: The Day The Earth Stood Still Just watched this on an anon's recommendation. Rather disappointing, I ended up more confused by it than the ending of Big O. Feels like the creators just presumed its audience already read all the manga and didn't feel like it was necessary to explain shit. At least I finally know the inspiration for one of my favorite fighting game characters.
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>>5683 That's how I felt about it too after my first watch, but I've come to like the fact that we're just dropped into its world without an inkling of exposition. AFAIK the Yokoyama estate is pretty protective of their IPs so it's not like we're ever gonna get the original Giant Robo manga (or god forbid, Tetsujin 28-go) available in English, anyway. I'm a sucker for the mechanical and character designs, though.
>>5708 The complete lack of explanation for many, many things isn't even the whole problem with it. The thing is overloaded with bad cliches and extremely weak character interaction. It's hard to feel anything about big explosive action when you're kept in the dark about everyone's motivation.
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>>5711 Oh come on, the cliches are awesome! Giant Robo is one of the oldest mecha IPs in the history of the genre. I think it's easy enough to deduce factional and character motivations early on. I mean yeah I could've used more backstory on the conflict with Big Fire but I don't think it's as necessary to enjoy the OVA series itself.
>>5714 Boy-who-can't-make-up-his-mind-whether-to-act-for-no-discernible-reason is definitely not awesome.
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>>5716 That's part of the drama: boy-who-can't-make-up-his-mind-whether-to-act-because-he's-a-boy. He nearly got all of his comrades killed by episodes 3 and 4 because he acted so brazenly.
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>>5721 Every time I saw that sphere all I could think of was the giant eye in Angel's Egg.
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Oh no. I'm feeling it again. Like, I'm not the only one here that thinks KOTM kinda sucked, right? The last time I gave it any length of thought I summarised it as "Final Wars but not fun". Haven't seen it again since release too. Honestly, isn't it kinda like another Uprising when you compare it to the strengths of 2014 (like build-up, weight, scale, cinematography)? Not even gonna talk about the human and military shit. Lotta fans seemed to like it though. I'm just gonna take a potshot and group them as the kind of people that think those lazy opaque laser edits of 2014's beautifully done atomic breath (translucent, fiery and not overdone) are somehow an improvement. Y'know, those "muh men in rubber suits wrestling" fans. Maybe I can gather my thougths better after I see it again. It's even hazier compared to my memory of Uprising. I've never even bothered to rewatch the kaiju/action scenes. It's that uninteresting to me, apparently. I remember the nice shots in the trailers end up being most of the best ones and the fights are blurs in my mind. The one scene that stood out in my memory was godzilla's light show warning display. That actually felt like something from the 2014 movie. Otherwise, things are just not as tense, built-up or even simply visually captivating. It almost feels more like a parody/fan work at times rather than an honest creative effort at kaiju cinema. You'd think they'd delve futher into the tone set by the first (especially the comic-con teaser) but nah. Oh, the music was kinda eh too compared to 2014's. The repeated usage of the iconic march in particular felt hokey in the way only superfan-types enjoy. Perhaps I'm being needlessly picky. I don't know. Ultimately, what I do know is garegoji > 2019 design.
>>5733 I have to disagree. I don't think KOTM is some excellent movie because the fact is, KOTM is a cheap monster movie with silly themes and funny moments (intentionally or not). It's basically the cheese of a typical Godzilla multi-monster movie but on a higher budget. I enjoyed it as a spectacle, and because despite its flaws, a lot of it was better than the 2014 movie, which was human focused but lacked something that would make it a compelling story. The subversion of "The Bad Guy Wants to Save The World By Destroying It" is also pretty funny - gives me 4th War Naruto vibes. Unlike Uprising, which had a obviously better prior film, KOTM was more vibrant and lively compared to the 2014 Godzilla, and the physics of both films are not all together different. I disliked the 2014 version because it took itself way too seriously and never showed Godzilla fight until the end (in utter darkness) which is blueballing the audience way too much for a short reveal and rather anticlimactically fast fight. The seriousness is undercut by illogical decisions and the excessive dramatic acting and lack of actual attempts at realism like what Shin Godzilla did (which is why I like that film despite having even less Godzilla screentime than the 2014 one). >2014's beautifully done atomic breath It looks like a cheaply done flame effect you could buy online and was way too thin. It's not realistic or better looking when it looks like farted out a bit of napalm from his mouth or spat out one of those fire Martini's. The 2019's atomic breath retains the flame-like aspect but really projects the power of it far more because of how solid and strong it is. >garegoji design The 2019 design is better because he doesn't look like an overstuffed Godzilla from some Deviantart account, and his motion is smoother, yet still has weight. <body proportion The 2014 version's head is disproportionately small and his legs are far too short and thick, giving him an absurd look, especially when he moves around far more than his model should allow. It would be like an obese man boxing quickly. Outside of Butterbean, I don't think I've seen that ever. The 2019 versions slightly bigger head, longer neck and wider shoulders mean that his movements being quick were more natural-looking and not heaved like a sack of potatoes. These slight changes made the character look very different. Also the lack of elephant like feet makes him look like a reptile in the 2019 movie. <the roar The 2014 roar was also anticlimactic; sounded like a a upscaled human scream with a clip of the original godzilla rumble placed on the end. That said, the 2019 version did do the roar worse IMO. https://www.thekaijuologist.com/post/comparing-designs-godzilla-2014-vs-godzilla-king-of-the-monsters
>>857 >looks like a frog Frogs are based, so that's fine.
I just finished SDF Macross and enjoyed it a lot However, I am curious if later installments are less pro-military and sexist. I'm not the kind of person who has to have their media reflect their ideology, but the parts about womens nature and the entire last arc felt off. Wondering if it is just 80's anime writing or a Macross series thing.
>>5787 That's probably the 80s there.
>>5737 https://desuarchive.org/m/thread/14636859/#14637633 An old post on what I enjoyed about 2014's depiction of kaiju. A reply to the usual. I don't care that it's "only one fight". I do care that every other scene of or with kaiju were done as spectacularly as they were. I was hoping to see this continue but >KOTM is a cheap monster movie with silly themes and funny moments (intentionally or not). I also posted somewhere, maybe old /leftypol/ or /leftyweebpol/ (or 4/m/?), about my thoughts on 2014's handling of characters. I feel humans in kaiju films usually work better when they're treated as a collective instead of giving too much focus on a single person. Keeping it short, the mistake was putting too much focus on Ford in the middle instead of saving him for the literal airdrop into the 3rd act (keep the train scene tho). The middle was a good oppurtunity to put Monarch into the spotlight. If Joe survived he could be still be relevant in this way. Now, whatever reservations I have about 2014 is nothing compared to the mess that is KOTM. >I enjoyed it as a spectacle I didn't enjoy it much beyond the parts I mentioned because, as spectacle, it doesn't capture how the various kaiju scenes were built-up and handled previously. I was never as awed, excited or tense as I was during the muto escape, goji's arrival, the airport scene, the train, goji and mutos touring in san-fran, the airdrop and of course the various parts of the final battle. One of my favourite shots is the overhead view of goji swimming between the carriers because it was downright beautiful. Moments like that or the jets falling helplessly into the ocean have this wonderful otherworldly feeling without having to resort to disaster porn or overt apocalyptic imagery. Goji's threat display scene falls into this nicely. >because took itself way too seriously I really don't see how. There's much room between taking it too seriously and not taking it seriously at all. 2014 is not as dark as the concept trailer, but still serious enough with its narrative and visuals that I as a viewer am able to regard the kaiju as more than just shallow setpieces. I get it. It's nice to see goji and ghidorah onscreen together. But I'm not going to enjoy it much by the fact alone without the cinematic merit to prop it up. >seriousness is undercut by illogical decisions and the excessive dramatic acting and lack of actual attempts at realism This literally sounds like criticism against KOTM though. One film opens with a nuclear bombing and the other with a family losing their child. One has the military fail every step of their plan while the other has them flying around the world in a sci-fi plane, a hot potato kaiju-hailing device and other silliness. Getting some pretty mixed messages from KOTM. >It's not realistic w-what >napalm from his mouth That's not cool? Even with higher brightness that eliminates its translucence, the breath is not simply slightly wavy. It's very irregular with a hint of gaseousness. Also how it "splashes" off the target area. I love it. Reminds me of The Next's beautiful finisher. >2019's atomic breath retains the flame-like aspect Checked a vid. The one time it did was the one that pushed off ghidorah before mothra divebombed. Even then, it's still cleaner and I personally just don't like how big it gets. >overstuffed That's...why I like garegoji more? The new "classical" spines I don't think meshes as well compared to the simpler peaks. Makes the back look too busy and adds needless heft, imo. Unless you mean he's fat, then I don't see much difference between the two beyond the spines, longer toe claws and thicker tail end. Proportions look virtually the same. Both are capable of looking larger than they actually are at times. >giving him an absurd look, especially when he moves around far more than his model should allow. I don't recall garegoji moving with any unnatural haste or grace in his runtime. >his motion is smoother, yet still has weight. Weight, I feel, took a drop in 2019. So did the sense of scale. The more animated, less realistic movement of camera... Like I said, a bit like Uprising. >his movements being quick were more natural-looking I do remember noticing and just saw from a clip how weird 2019 goji moves sometimes, usually in faster moments like when he's grappling with ghidorah. Whatever design he has doesn't help here nor do I think the speed is at fault. It's just poorly animated. >the lack of elephant like feet makes him look like a reptile in the 2019 movie. Sauropods existed, anon. So did hoofed crocodiles. RIP stubby claws, you were charming.
One more thing. For posterity's sake.
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>>5802 The early pelycosaurs with teensy tiny heads were all herbivorous. Same for ankylosaur and stegosaur dinosaurs. I don't think Godzilla has ever been depicted as a herbivore.
>>5809 >Same for anylosaur and stegosaur Hmm, that's true. Was going for the "It's not that weird" angle with cotylorhynchus. Then there's this thing. >It is larger than any other known predatory archosaur from the Late Triassic or Early Jurassic of central Europe. They're not even sure if it's a dinosaur or a pseudosuchian. Speaking of, godzilla could totally work as a pseudosuchian.
>>5800 >I also posted somewhere YES! I recognize this post, I argued with you on this last time on 8ch, LOL. >humans in kaiju films usually work better when they're treated as a collective instead of giving too much focus on a single person. This basically. It's why Shin Godzilla was great IMO. A few 'main characters' who were constantly supplemented with other characters, and not on the forefront too much either. >awed or tense I can agree there. However with the airport scene as an example, they do the same issue over and over again - building up the tension and then just as Godzilla comes on screen or the Kaiju begin to do something, they cut away. I wouldn't even mind the cut-aways if they showed at least the beginning of one of the incoming fights for a moment before doing that. >the overhead view of goji swimming between the carriers A good shot I'll give you that >or the jets falling helplessly into the ocean Basically all the trailer shots like those were epic, i's really why I was so disappointed wit a lot of the rest of it. >2014 is not as dark as the concept trailer What I mean is that it goes for this dark disaster type movie, but the over-acting (or insufficient acting) by most characters is annoying and they don't make deaths or destruction feel like anything important, it feels like a poorly acted theatrical tragedy that isn't bad enough to be funny, and isn't good enough to praise. The plane scene before they air-drop is so generic you could splice it with Suicide Squad's scene. >Getting some pretty mixed messages from KOTM. Well to be fair, that's literally every Godzilla movie featuring other monsters. KOTM streamlined a long history of cheesy sci-fi weapons/technology/vehicles and monster melee plots - you have the Ghidorah space intruder (1964), you have the Guardian Godzilla, you have SuperNuclear Godzilla (1995), an Oxygen Destroyer device (1954) and more. And it even references some things like Godzilla the Animated Series (1998) with Rodan being in Mexico. The ending also sequel-baits for Mecha-Ghidorah (1991). This is a lot of work to put into 1 film. And the serious scenes contrasting with other silly character scenes works because the silly scenes are never during or with the serious ones and while the movie takes ITSELF seriously, the film-makers are obviously just having fun. >That's not cool? If it was it's own film yes, but a long history of atomic beams and other breath attacks makes it less impressive to me. >The Next ? >he's fat Basically this. KOTM lengthened the neck and widened the shoulders enough so that he looked balanced and not like a child's drawing of a dinosaur with a teeny head. >longer toe claws It's a small but noticeable detail that changes how he looks when standing or charging. >garegoji moving with any unnatural haste or grace It's more that the shoulders and body rolled unnaturally at times, and then other times he can barely move, like an over-stuffed doll with stiff joints. >Sauropods existed <hoofed crocodiles TRUE, BUT they were quadrupedal animals and Godzilla is very much a bipedal one, like a therapod dinosaur, hence the clawed feet. >>5802 And coylorhynchus looks absurd (and is a herbivore)
>>5787 The only "good" guys in Frontier are the archetypal private military contractors mavericks that tend to show up in fiction with military setting. Kawamori is kinda like the "wow cool robot!" guy, he just added "wow hot idols!" into mix.
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>>5821 Was kinda wondering if anybody remembered but turns you're the same anon! >It's why Shin Godzilla was great IMO. A few 'main characters' who were constantly supplemented with other characters, and not on the forefront too much either. Precisely, unless, they have some good or batshit insane ideas for a main character that would keep viewer's interest besides the spectacle. I made another post (again, don't remember where) where I half-jokingly proposed "Nightcrawler but with kaiju". An obsessed kaiju-chaser that would do anything to capture the perfect moment. Would be hilarious and horrifying. >they cut away. I wouldn't even mind the cut-aways if they showed at least the beginning of one of the incoming fights for a moment before doing that. I believe it's just that, at this point, I've grown to focus on what's there more than what's not. A half full/half empty thing. It would've been nice to see more but that doesn't make the scenes that are there any less good. And there's plenty, I think. The bridge scene for example is pure scale porn. Not that kind, dummy. >A good shot I'll give you that It also highlights why I prefer his old fins. The main three rows that stick out when submerged is a pretty iconic part of garegoji. It's the first thing we see when he surfaces in Hawaii. The new busier design wouldn't look as good in these kinds of moments imo. >all the trailer shots like those were epic, i's really why I was so disappointed wit a lot of the rest of it. That's what I feel about KOTM. Some of the problems you have with 2014 are the same problems I have with the sequel. I don't remember much action or money shots in 2014's trailers though. >it goes for this dark disaster type movie Wait, let me rephrase myself. I don't think 2014 is dark at all! It's just plain serious. >KOTM streamlined a long history of cheesy sci-fi Referencing or, even better, integrating older stuff is perfectly fine but some of them just feel really shallow. It comes off more like the "nerd-bait" stuff you'd find in franchises like Star Wars or capeshit. >And the serious scenes contrasting with other silly character scenes works because the silly scenes are never during or with the serious ones and while the movie takes ITSELF seriously, the film-makers are obviously just having fun. Tone is the biggest problem I have with it. Pacific Rim achieved this just fine while I don't think KOTM really did. One moment, goji's fins literally light up like lightbulbs. Next, Sally Hawkins gets fuckin' flattened (RIP, what a waste). Or when the fodder says a clearly comedic "oh shit" before being vaporised. What? Every blockbuster seems to require these off-kilter moments of levity that any sensible viewer would find cringeworthy and out of place. Old stuff is usually unintentionally funny and this ain't a comedy, so why even? >KOTM lengthened the neck and widened the shoulders enough so that he looked balanced I honestly don't notice any changes beyond the major three. He still looks like a chonker at times. The base design is simply wide front to back. He looks pretty normal head-on. It's similar to how a theropod looks smaller from the front.
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>>5821 Btw, >? My favourite ultra-ray.
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Reminder that Discotek are gonna release Acrobunch on blu-ray in February and that they're having a stream on the 14th that'll have more announcements: https://mobile.twitter.com/discotekmedia/status/1336386140325068800
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>>5853 There's bound to be more /m/ stuff; I hope they license Red Baron tbh.
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>>5850 >An obsessed kaiju-chaser that would do anything to capture the perfect moment. Would be hilarious and horrifying. Sounds like me TBH >The bridge scene for example is pure scale porn <not that kind Yeah that was a fairly decent scene, You know what you were doing!. >The fins The fins were an unecessary change I'll grant you that. They certainly were striking when we see the 'atom bomb' footage where the hulking mass rises out of the depths back first. >It's just plain serious which is why I dislike a lot of aspects. The funny and "oh shit" moments (like the train scene on Hawaii) were better than the poorly done human drama. >comes off more like the "nerd-bait" stuff you'd find in franchises like Star Wars or capeshit I suppose so, I enjoyed that meshing of storylines TBH. Only wished Mothra would have gotten more expansion >Every blockbuster seems to require these off-kilter moments of levity that any sensible viewer would find cringeworthy and out of place I mean that's true of a lot of films TBH, it was pure cheesiness >He still looks like a chonker The devil is in the details for me. >similar to how a theropod looks smaller from the front Aye, but the sideview was what bothered me in 2014.
>>5853 they're live right now; started about ten minutes ago: https://www.twitch.tv/discotekmedia
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>>5945 >>5946 buncha new /m/ licenses and updates on restoration projects
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>>5949 the comparison shots of the Project-Ako upscale are fucking magical https://twitter.com/discotekmedia/status/1338658093496877056
>>5949 >>5950 Impressive, through I'm glad they're issuing "best of both worlds" SD BD releases, so we aren't stuck with a Faustian choice of either bitrate-restricted DVDs, or hamfistedly "enhanced" HD BD upscales.
>>5976 Agreed; they even had a slide explaining why SD-BD's have become their format of choice for these kinds of shows.
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So has anyone watched Dougram?
>>5787 Same dude, back again. Macross 7 is extremely comfy and the different tones between Macross series has kept the series interesting. I like the silly and the serious. Going from Plus to 7 was a trip tho


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