No.20110
i also apply moral judgements when deciding whether to like or hate a fictional characters
No.20111
>>20110Fuck off. When someone is introduced as a puppy killer, you're supposed to hate them. That's moral judgment. Cunt.
No.20112
>>20111yeah i also hate fictional characters
No.20113
You just aren't into it. Rance is basically "let's make a terrible person the hero and roll with it", meant as a parody of Ys' MC, the fact he kind of has such a strong niche is what makes him so endearing, because you aren't going to find the same flavor anywhere else.
He's shown to be effectively an anti-thesis to Japanese culture, someone who does what they wants, defies the nature and societal order. He's naturally gifted and has plenty of talent, but he's lazy and unless the situation truly calls for it he falls into depravity instead. He's an exceptionally flawed 'hero' that could easily become a villain in multiple other settings (and even his own). Put through another lens he's actually a pretty horrific, selfish bastard. He's not really idealized or perfect in a way a mary sue or gary stu is. He constantly gets criticized by other characters in his own setting and even others (Evenicle). His faults and failings make the games what they are, rather than his strengths. The central drama in Sengoku Rance's normal route for example comes from how much of a fucking tool he is and he's almost perfectly manipulated by someone in very clear open daylight. The games are filled with flaws like these that hurt him personally and emotionally.
Rance isn't really guaranteed to win anything any more than the player is guaranteed to win and has had some pretty shitty stuff happen to him, despite winning.
The whole point of the character is getting to play the villain. His personality gets him in trouble constantly and he gets by mostly on luck and wit. Guy joined the army and got kicked out day 1 because he wouldn't follow orders.
No.20257
it's for ppl who have rape porn fetish u naive dummy
No.22259
people who like him likely are spineless cowards, so they like him as a self insert, as he is capable of doing what they want, and he does what they want. I think that’s concerning.
No.22260
>>22259this is gigaprojection
No.22261
the worst trend to take off is people trying to find moral justifications for liking or disliking something. sometimes a thing is just good or bad, sometimes a thing is for you or it isnt
No.22264
>>22263>channer buzzwords coupled with moralismyawn
No.22265
>>22259>>22263By this logic any character a reader likes is made for "self-inserting". Rance isn't a blank slate character at all.
>I think that’s concerning.XD
No.22268
>>22261With Rance in particular I feel like the black comedy really softens things, add that in with the context of it being an eroge and it doesn't come off as offensive as it might have otherwise, for me anyway.
I've only played Sengoku Rance but I was blown away by how much I was having fun with it. Humor is spot on, the gameplay is actually well designed, and tracks from the OST still pop into my head now and then. You can tell that Alicesoft is a studio with 30 years of experience.
I also watched the old 90's OVA and it was honestly a lot of fun.
No.22271
>>20109you are not really supposed to read the dialogues or follow the story, much less get emotionally invested. go straight for the mechanics and the porn
the writer needs a plot and characters that can produce sex scenes. these scenes have to include rape because japanese society thinks consent is anti-erotic. rance and his universe are the path of least resistance
lets do an exercise so you can see it, try to imagine a character that has an excuse to go around killing people and raping women (and with the unequal power dynamic the japanese public likes) but that you would find likeable
even easier, try applying same criteria to your average ck2 character, and now imagine if the game also had to include fucked up sex scenes
No.22272
>>22271You are missing a lot then. Rance is one of the few eroge that actually would be great even if it was only a story without gameplay or even porn. The writing, world building and characterisation are that good.
In fact aside from Sengoku all other series are turn off in terms of gameplay for me. Too much grind and repetition while walking in samey blocky dungeons.
No.22274
>>22271Stop having opinions about games you haven't even played, jesus.
No.22276
>>22272I've had fun with all Rance games (even 5D) but it's always at the endgame and/or postgame where the grinding gets too much for me and I have to
bring out Cheat Engine.
No.22279
>>20109>why do otaku like this guyBecause its edgy and also plays to some of their fantasies
>I can't stand him That's fine, even if you want to associate with/identify as an Otaku or weeb, you don't necessarily have to share the exact same likes and dislikes. HxH is very popular, I don't really like it, and that's fine, there's no cult-leader forcing you to like it. I personally don't care for Rance much, however I also don't care if people like it, it's not my problem, and as long as the shitty aspects remain fictional, then there's little harm done.
>I HATE hate himRelax, breathe in and let it go comr8, there's bigger problems in the world than some VN protag.
No.22283
He's a realistic depiction of what an otaku sort of man would actually do without any of the sad sappy bullshit that the revenge of healer had in his backstory.
No.22286
>>22283not rly, its simply a ys parody that started from an injoke what if adol was a horny bastard
No.22287
>>22276I skipped 5D and only read about games after sengoku. Honestly they should just put them on steam, since it allows porn now. I also used cheat engine since i never was a fan of their dungeon crawling mechanic.
>>22279>Because its edgy and also plays to some of their fantasies The answer is wrong because the premise is. I wouldn't call Rance a particularly popular character. It's hard to play into someone's fantasies when the character has actual personality and not a complete blank slate.
>>22279>HxH is very popularIt's really not. It's pretty niche.
No.22288
>>22287 NTA but
>I wouldn't call Rance a particularly popular character.Rance was pretty well known among weebs/otaku that play VNs, even if it's not talked about as much today. From what I've seen of unironic fans, they either identify with Rance or just enjoy the edginess.
>It's really not. It's pretty niche. <HxHMaybe 10 years ago, but by this point, HxH is pretty big in the anime community, the only reason people think its not is because it was the gateway anime for a lot of 2010s contrarians that wanted to like shonen but pretend to be deeper than the rest (proof of that being the shitflinging threads between shonen fans of HxH and the Big Three). Also HxH was under the shadow the Big Three and Dragon Ball making it appear less popular, even though that is untrue. Mention Hunter x Hunter on any anime forum I can think of and people WILL recognize it and a lot of them like it, hell it's rare to find a post actually shitting on it, which indicates a general liking of it.
To clarify - being well known does not necessarily mean mainstream.
No.22291
>>22287Yup, the whole point of criticizing a character for being a "self-insert" is that they're bland/boring/blank slate, which Rance definitely isn't. Even the romance options don't turn into 0 personality sex slaves either. Also, there's a whole separate character in the setting that pokes fun at the generic isekai protagonist trope.
Hell, I always suspect everybody calling him their "self-insert" to be idiots that never played the games and only know him from the epic rape chad meme. Rance is a comedy MC first and foremost and the game goes out of its way to let you know you aren't supposed to take such a childish meathead seriously.
For similar reasons and what
>>20113 posted it really doesn't make sense to call him a "mary sue" either.
>>22288>Rance was pretty well known among weebs/otaku that play VNsThat's such a small pool of people, man… (Sadly…)
>they either identify with Rance or just enjoy the edginessThat "or" is doing a lot of legwork there. People who play a black comedy game enjoy black comedy, huh.
No.22293
>>22288>pretend to be deeper than the restNothing to pretend tho, it is deeper. Even if because of that it can often devolve into walls of text.
No.22294
>>22291>Rance is a comedy MC first and foremost and the game goes out of its way to let you know you aren't supposed to take such a childish meathead seriously.He also constantly fucks up precisely because of his shitty behaviour. He is his own worst enemy more often than not. Which is kinda the opposite of what Mary Sue is.
Also, i think that his character progression should be mentioned. If at first he was an asshole bungling about and lucking into some (sorta) heroic deeds and recognition, with series progression he had to face himself being an asshole the consequences of his actions and actually choosing to do the right thing. And without loosing what makes him Rance. I think it was like Rance VI where he was at his lowest point morally storywise yet where you could see the cinflict between an asshole rance and hero rance leaning towards hero.
No.22295
>>22292I honestly wouldn't mind more characters who are not rance's harem, but i guess you have to aim for the lowest common denominator when market is concerned.
No.22296
>>22293>Nothing to pretend tho, it is deeper.LMAO, it really isn't any deeper than most Shonen anime. Maybe Bleach or DBZ, but its really not more than that. If you get something deeper from it, good for you I suppose.
No.22297
>>22296It is a deconstruction of shonen tropes. And a pretty good one at that. If you don't see that, that's on you i guess.
No.22298
>>22274I have played like 5 videogames, and even made one that people buy, for money. I know what I'm talking about
No.22299
>>22292I'm kind of sick of harems myself, I believe it has something to do with the fact that one can always root for a "best girl" to come out on top of these things, it's kind of like a sports competition with how those things come out. You can put out some real dross but get some cute girls on a line up in a beauty contest and people will want to see it.
No.22305
>>22304Which is why she is one of the shittiest writers, along with Tolkien and his "nooooo it's not an allegory" cope.
No.22306
>>22304This thread is people talking about the quality of Rance as a character and why people like him. No one's treating the plot of the games like some Aesop fable.
No.22307
>>22305youre very stupid and probably also an american
No.22309
>>22304The antique anglo idea of fiction being necessary moral instruction: if a piece of fiction can't justify itself with a parable, what is its utility then?!
>>22305People like this is why I still have a little sympathy for the "the curtains are just blue" people. At least they still have an appreciation for a story just being valuable in itself.
>>22306To be fair the OP
was trying to make this about actual morals.
No.22311
>>22309>OP was trying to make this about actual morals.No? OP just said they don't like Rance because they think the character has nothing interesting about himself beyond being an asshole. I disagree, but that's not the same as calling a character bad because they're an asshole even though it seems similar.
No.22313
>>22312>>22309>>22307So many butthurt pseuds. If an author is consistently "misinterpreted" it just means they are a shit author who doesn't know how to use the tools of literary expression properly. Also they may be just dishonest with themself like Tokien who was clearly influenced by first and second world war, but denied it vehemently (probably because it didn't paint a very nice picture of himself)
>youre very stupid and probably also an americanThat's a lot of projection, whitey boy.
No.22316
>>22313it's not even that, why should i care solely about what the author intends for the story when it's more interesting to bring my own and other people's perspectives into it. "misinterpretation" is a spook
No.22319
>>22316Misinterpretation is what pseud authors (and directors like Lynch) are whining about because they couldn't make the art speak for itself. Or they didn't like what it told about themself.
No.22324
Rance was conceived by a team of women. Rance is every woman's fantasy man.
No.22325
>>22324it’s always the bitchless mfs
No.22327
>>20109>>22271>the writer needs a plot and characters that can produce sex scenes.but that's y its shit tho
ranch story is poopoo
>>22292>13 Sentinels: Aegis Rimunderstandable, based gayme
No.22328
>>22321Just because you don't understand literary analysis doesn't mean that people who engage in it just talking out of their ass.
No.22343
I for one agree with OP, I tried playing one of those games and Rance was just so annoying it wasn't worth it. If you're gonna make the MC an actual character for a game like this, make them a pervert that's actually scheming and trying to get away with stuff so it feels like the story is about whether they'll get away with their perversions, rather than a generic asshole that society magically gives a free pass to. Hell, you can even still make them a generic asshole, but everyone should at least treat them as such.
No.22344
>>22327>the writer needs a plot and characters that can produce sex scenes.Corruption of champions is a fucking masterpiece compared to this bullshit.
No.22348
>>22343>>22344rofl why do terminally online people only express their opinions in hyperbole
hell i dont think youve even played rance OR coc at all
>generic asshole that society magically gives a free pass tolike youre so wrong and its stuff that the thread already talked about so you couldnt even read the thread before opining on things you dont know about…
No.22350
>>22348why on earth would I lie about that lmao? coc also had way better sex scenes, rance gave me blue balls for like an hour, every time he'd open his stupid mouth I'd get soft.
No.22351
>>22350so your issue is that it didnt turn you on so its "shit"? and because coc did that makes it a "masterpiece"? and the character being an asshole hurts your moral sensibilities? god forbid fiction doesnt try to have epic wholesome chungus role models all the time
No.22352
>>22351God forbid fiction have likeable characters, clearly real life isn't filled enough with bad people
No.22354
>>22352clearly a lot of people like rance? uh?? not everything needs to appeal to everyone and can only fill a niche
No.22355
>>22351a hentai game is bad if it's not actually erotic, correct.
No.22356
>>22355An eroge doesn't stop being eroge because you don't like it, what even is this stupid argument?
No.22357
No wonder the side boards are dead when the average discussion is this bad.
No.22361
>>22357this is just the average quality of discussion you'll find in anything revolving anime
No.22363
>>22361This is a thread about video games but yes, but isn't that sad, that a niche imageboard with a couple dozen regular posters like leftypol is worse than the average? Worst of both worlds.
No.22365
>>22358You sound like a basic bitch, "anon".
No.22393
>>22392>YA author's wholesome game clawswhat the fuck are you talking about?
No.22397
>>22344>Corruption of champions is a fucking masterpiece compared to this bullshit.understandable and maybe based
No.22398
>>22365nah, you sound like a poser and a pretentious snob
>I didn't enjoy it but I still say it is good because hmmm, internet said so, ok? No.22400
>>22398You're literally making up someone in your head to get mad at. Please go back to /v/.
No.22410
none of these people can process characters more than “good” or “bad, something as simple as someone who isn’t a good person or a nice person but is a Heroic person breaks their breams
No.22583
>>22292Whatever anyone wants to say with art is diluted if the medium is interactive, because ultimately, players want to make their own choices and enjoy games in their own way.
No.24357
>>24340Rance is a "parody" of Ys, zoomie. They wanted to make Ys but with the protagonist being an amoral rapist that immediately expanded in world-building and characterization with the following games and the main characters end up changing the status quo of the world more than Ys itself, even.
Konosuba gives up the facade of a parody pretty quickly and ends up playing all the cliches straight. It gets even worse in the volumes that haven't been adapted yet.
>the concept of "subversive media" at all< Unique IPs: 22