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/edu/ - Education

'The weapon of criticism cannot, of course, replace criticism of the weapon, material force must be overthrown by material force; but theory also becomes a material force as soon as it has gripped the masses.' - Karl Marx
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 No.13614

Oliver Cromwell was the greatest British Revolutionary.
Oliver Cromwell is akin to Robspierre, a revolutionary far ahead of his time, which helped develope a revolutionary tradition within britain and inspire europe itself to light itself aflame in the fires of revolt. His reforms introduced democracy not only to the state but to all of society itself. His New Model army was itself based of a democratic foundation which pushed for discussion and debate within its ranks in order to make the army iteslf a ideological extension of Parlimentary Political thought, something which was also seen within the Red Army.
Since then, a pile of dirt was thrown across Cromwells grave and he was deemed a imperialist, a genocider, and other such statements which were fabricated by the Royalist restorationists with no basis for such claims other than trying to de-legitimize a authentic Revolutionary which was Cromwell. While not as radical as the Levellers or Diggers, Cromwell still stands as a progressive and revolutionary hero in British history, and rehabilitating his image amongst Marxists and Britons as a whole would lay the foundations for a revolutionary revival in Britain.



In short' I'd like to end with a quote from Trotsky: "British workers can learn incomparably more from Cromwell than from MacDonald, Snowden, Webb and other such compromising brethren. Cromwell was a great revolutionary of his time, who knew how to uphold the interests of the new, bourgeois social system against the old aristocratic one without holding back at anything. This must be learnt from him, and the dead lion of the seventeenth century"

https://www.marxists.org/archive/trotsky/works/britain/ch06.htm
https://www.marxists.org/archive/hill-christopher/english-revolution/

 No.13615

I'd just like to share my favourite Cromwell quote here
>I beg you from the bottom of my bowels consider the possibility you are wrong

 No.13616

>>13615
It's actually 'in the bowels of christ think it possible ye might be mistaken'

 No.13617

File: 1683466447562.png (191.35 KB, 480x360, ClipboardImage.png)

>>13614
Based and IMT-pilled

 No.13618

File: 1683466982345.jpg (20.86 KB, 188x338, Sickle_and_Hammer.jpg)

>>13616
You are indeed correct the actual quote is
>I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ, think it possible that you may be mistaken
Tankyoo foar teh correction comrade

 No.13619

Kill yourself

 No.13620

File: 1683467251301.png (7.99 MB, 1986x3000, ClipboardImage.png)

Highly recommend the 1970 film 'Cromwell' for a brief overview of the Lord Protector's rise to power. It has its inaccuracies but Richard Harris nails it as Cromwell, and the film overall takes a much more anti-monarchy stance compared to most pieces of British media covering the subject.

 No.13621

>>13620
>Highly recommend
Thanks anon, gonna watch this sometime. Peak era Harris.

 No.13622

Someone has to post that real comfy image with the man reading a newspaper with a pint of beer in a socialist england. Best image I've seen here to date.

 No.13623

File: 1683487580813.png (2.47 MB, 1472x1158, ClipboardImage.png)

he regreted killing the king, which makes him a bitch

 No.13624

>>13620
DUMBLEDORE is heckin CROMWELL

and

OBI WAN KENOBI is heckin KING CHARLES?!?!?!

 No.13625

>>13623
Sad if true

 No.13626

>>13619
Mad because you know its the correct stance.

 No.13627

>>13625
he would go down to Cromwell's coffin once a day and open it up and mutter "cruel necessity" at him. imagine apologizing for winning

 No.13628

IRELAND DISAGREES

'Twas 1659 forgotten now for sure
They dragged us from our homeland
With the musket and their gun
Cromwell and his roundheads
Battered all we know
Shackled hopes of freedom
We're now but stolen goods
Darken the horizon
Blackened from the sun
This rotten cage of Bridgetown
Is where I now belong

 No.13629

File: 1683488909690.webm (3.6 MB, 640x360, based_touissant.webm)

what's with the threads about pre-Marxist revolutions lately? There's also that Robespierre thread rolling around. Should we also get a Touissant thread going?

 No.13630

>>13623
Is this true or is this another "Darwin rejected the evolution before death"?

 No.13631

File: 1683490066136.jpg (37.5 KB, 500x680, Bike-Fall.jpg)

>>13628
If you didn't want to get your teeth kicked in by the New Model Army, you shouldn't have harboured and allied with the reactionary English royalists who were trying to undermine the new republic. Simple as.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Ormonde_Peace

 No.13632

>>13630
idk

the source for the claim seems to be Oliver Cromwell : A History (1895) by Samuel Harden Church, p. 321

 No.13633

>>13624
He should've wiped out the entire landed aristocracy/nobility.

 No.13634

>>13633
that's what the OP doesn't understand. Cromwell was a constitutional monarchist who didn't even want to kill thing king. The king forced his hand by refusing to compromise. The only truly based people we can even call "proto-socialist" were the "Diggers" led by Gerrard Winstanley, but they were so ahead of their time, there was only a few hundred of them, and they were incapable of mobilizing a mass movement.

 No.13635

>>13634
kill the king*

 No.13636

>>13628
Restorationist propaganda that ignores historic facts, including the acts passed by cromwell that allowed catholics to priately practice in peace. Any sort of repressions while Cromwell was actually present were targeted against agitators and rioters, any repressions while he was gone were largely out of his hands and had mixed aproaches due to the decentral nature of governence of the time. Dont fall for monarchist propaganda bros

 No.13637

>>13629
Do it o7

 No.13638

>>13634
While the diggers were far more revolutionary and progressive than Cromwell, that doesn't disregard cromwells achivemnets in democratic organization (such as that witnessed in the new model army) and empowerment of the parliment and the borgouise (which during this era were a progressive force). As for the comment comparing him to a Monarch, simplifies the complexity of the situation quite a lot, the "Humble Petition and Advice" constitution codified the role of role protector as one which is passed down by nomination and not as a hereditary title. Cromwell came to describe himself as a "caretaker" rather than a absolutist ruler and his government functioned based on the delegation and distribution of power, while beurocratic was far more progressive than anything at the time.

Despite his many flaws in comparison to modern movements, you cannot deny his stremendous leaps in revolutionary organisation and inspiring europe as a whole to go down the road of revolution.

 No.13639

>>13636
The Cromwellian conquest of Ireland in 1649 which was a response to the Irish Rebellion of 1641 is a little more complicated than you're letting on. Yes, the Irish sided with the royalists against the parliament, but that was strategic rather than ideological. Both King Charles and Oliver Cromwell wanted to crush the Irish rebellion, but neither trusted the other to do it right. The Irish sided with the king against Cromwell because they perceived that as the proper strategy for securing their own independence from England.

 No.13640

File: 1683496191175.png (957.47 KB, 1000x1843, ClipboardImage.png)

time to post cromjak gemmies

 No.13641

>>13639
not quite

 No.13642

Good video on the role Puritanism played in England's bourgeois revolution.

 No.13643

>>13641
elaborate

 No.13644

File: 1683502531958.jpg (373.03 KB, 1920x1080, yIgizvQ.jpg)

Cromwell sisters….

 No.13645

File: 1683502685867.jpg (165.19 KB, 700x980, 1681031974922063.jpg)

>Oliver Cromwell was the greatest British Revolutionary.
My hatred towards Turks will never reach not even close to my hatred of anglos. Worse than slave owners, aristocrats or the bourgeoisie.

 No.13646

File: 1683503061489.jpg (150.58 KB, 1170x1672, 20230207_193611.jpg)

>>13645
Well we don't hate you anon <3

 No.13647

>>13643
The irish didnt nessecerily side with anyone, there were Puritan communities as much as there were Catholoc communities. The "irish" werent a homogenous mass.

 No.13648


 No.13649

He was a Protestant son of a cunt that suppressed the Catholic believers in Ireland. “Bloody” Mary did nothing wrong. Ave Maria.

 No.13650

File: 1683613754870-0.png (153.42 KB, 500x500, Grace smile cheerful.png)

File: 1683613754870-1.jpg (105.2 KB, 1024x683, FveMFHgXgAE2ayA.jpg)

Read monarchist propaganda.
Simp for Grace.
All hail HM King Charles III.

<So let us not lose the fight, that after we have seen the King in his Beauty, we should see a King in Blood; no, if the Laws of God, and the Mercy of the King not quench Fire-brands, but there should happen to be new flames, new wars, let all faithful Subjects be dismembered rather than one Member of his Sacred Person should be wounded, and let every loyal Hand in the three Nations be cut off, rather then the traitorous hand should touch his Royal Head. For if we should be deprived again of the King in his Beauty, the Beauty of the Land is gone, and misery of the Land will renew, we shall have old plundering, and rifling, and sequestering, and imprisoning, and braining, and gibbetting again; if the King suffer, let us not think to escape scot-free; if the King die, let us not think to live long after him, no, let us resolve of a general Massacre, and a Funeral of the whole Nation.

t. Tho. Reeve (1661)

 No.13651

File: 1683614362144.jpg (41.9 KB, 398x500, SirArthurHaselrig.jpg)

The real shot of Britain getting rid of the monarchy was this guy tbh: Sir Arthur Haselrig. Opposed Monarchy, opposed Cromwell's Commonwealth, opposed Lambert's junta, seized power and restored the Rump Parliament before being betrayed by Moncke. He wasn't as radical as the Diggers or Levellers, but he had a real shot at solidifying the gains of the Civil War and prevent a Restoration, if he had not trusted Moncke.

The Diggers were cool and all, but if you read the True Levellers Standard Advanced, you'll see how they were too pacifistic to really succeed.
>Our bodies as yet are in thy hand, our Spirit waits in quiet and peace, upon our Father for Deliverance; and if he give our Bloud into thy hand, for thee to spill, know this, That he is our Almighty Captain: And if some of you will not dare to shed your bloud, to maintain Tyranny and Oppression upon the Creation, know this, That our Bloud and Life shall not be unwilling to be delivered up in meekness to maintain universal Liberty, that so the Curse on our part may be taken off the Creation.

>And we shall not do this by force of Arms, we abhorre it, For that is the work of the Midianites, to kill one another; […]


Levellers were proto-bourgeois, they were pretty based too, but it was a slim chance to get An Agreement of the People past the Grandees, when they tried it IRL the Grandees drafted the Heads of Proposals and presented that to Charles instead.

 No.13652

File: 1683614521897.png (510.13 KB, 576x768, ClipboardImage.png)


 No.13653

File: 1683615142169.jpg (6.24 MB, 3000x4000, ingsoc.jpg)

>>13652
gemmy; here's higher res (maybe)

 No.13654

>>13653
This would be England now if Corbyn had taken the revolutionary course instead of trying to placate the r*mainers.


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