/tech/ - Technology

muh blockchain
give it up man, cringey 2010s tech optimism is fucking over
just give it up

>Is there an explicitly cooperative FOSS crowdfunding solution?
just put your IBAN account number up and people can send money to you. it's literally that easy. also
>muh cooperatives

>>20485
>Muh blockchain
Did I say that?
Also one of the central problems with blockchain currencies so far is that no one of them have fucking even attempted a cooperative model yet, it's all just the same iteration of the same classically liberal currency mechanism
>>20486
just put your IBAN account number up and people can send money to you
So that my central bank can shut my account down just like any other finance / social media corporation shuts down any dissent? What are you, a liberal?
>Also muh cooperatives
>citing Cockshott where it isn't valid
He also said cooperatives were a great transitional measure. So did Marx.

>>20486
Like uygha I'm not saying utilizing cooperatives beyond five years into a DotP. That's not the terrain we're finding ourselves within. Are you even familiar with Cockshott's work?

He's not familiar with the reality outside the walls of his mother's basement, so of course he's not aware of the realities faced by workers, tech workers in this case, in workplaces and on their free time administring the servers holding up a large chunk of what the online counterculture flippantly depends on (including this one).

Something a kin to the model outlined in the OP is definitely needed.

Sorry for the confusion OP, the site's been getting spammed hard lately, one guy or a raid with a buch of sus IPs. Once the jannies log on we'll be seeing a lot of red.

I like your idea, If only there was some kind of bouty board where people wanting to start coops can take up requests like this according to their skillset.

>>20486
You can have cooperatives in a planned economy too, including cybersoc.

To put the confusion to rest ITT with reference to sources:

Cockshott arguing cooperatives as a valid tactic prior to planning (image related):
>The Limits of Market Socialism, @23:50
https://youtu.be/XyxnG2ck-sw
**Then subsequently, with the revolutionary seizure of power by the proletariat,
he advocates for a process of whole national cooperativization (expropriation of the bourgeoisie), syndication (econo-political organization of the whole working class), and finally abolition of money (furthest blow toward capitalism yet, uniquely enabled by our contemporary material and social conditions in the 21st century) through the cybernetization of use value and ushering in communization, lower-phase, to adequately stave off counterrevolutionary success both internally and externally.**
>The Limits of Market Socialism @23:50
https://youtu.be/XyxnG2ck-sw

And finally:
>We acknowledge the co-operative movement as one of the transforming forces of the present society based upon class antagonism. Its great merit is to practically show, that the present pauperising, and despotic system of the subordination of labour to capital can be superseded by the republican and beneficent system of the association of free and equal producers.
- Karl Marx, The First International, 1866

>>20493
Lol post the whole thing dumbass
https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1866/08/instructions.htm#05

>>20494
Why are you crying?

>>20495
Great argument

>>20496
You realize the extended quote didn't disqualify anything advanced so far right?
We are not around the corner of a communist revolution currently anywhere in the anglophone/west. The best we can do is to force the envelope where progressive movements have carved out a path, just like OP is pointing to: progressive elements taking power into their own hands in the sphere of technological labor.
>We recommend to the working men to embark in co-operative production rather than in co-operative stores.
cooperative production is exactly what the tech workers in question are doing, just voluntarily, without the compensation it's worth, without security, always at risk of going up in thin air due to trouble with their main source of income (big tech employment/unemployment).

Also how come I get the feeling you've never been part of the day-to-day struggles of an actual communist party? How do you fundraise? Because we fundraise with cooperatives. Let me hear the big leaps forward in terms of sustaining your org, because I doubt you're the type that robs banks (and even then, bank robbing is hardly a stable/ever-sustainable source of revenue, even if it's doable in a few select scenarios).

OP both Lemmy and Mastodon run on ActivityPub and neither are "anarchist" or "ML", only individual instances are. also
>no GNU Social in the pic
boo

>>20498
the two main maintainers for the lemmy code and the operators for lemmy.ml are marxist-leninists
there's also the lemmygrad.ml instance which is explicitly marxist-leninist

>>20499
I know. just sayin'

>>20486
>muh cooperatives
This. Workers owning the means of production is literally liberalism.

>>20501
unironically this. communism entails the aufhebung of ownership

>>20502
Socialism is when government own and controls everything lmao 😂😂🤣🤣

>>20503
considering the government is the workers, yes? the very notion of private ownership vanishes. the state withers away, but government obviously doesn't, for government is transhistorical

What is it solving?

I'll add another perspective from praxis. This thing would have members all over the world. Cooperatives need to be incorporated in a state somewhere. I've looked into starting cooperatives and some jurisdictions have tight requirements for who can be a member. Which jurisdiction is the easiest if you have members all over the world?

>>20506
A country like Bolivia or Venezuela maybe?
I know that imperialist west social democratic governments passed some laws making it easier for their co-ops, but we wouldn't want to base there for reasons already mentioned (imperialist government, bound to bend over backwards in order to make it frustrate the transition I mentioned here >>20493 )
But that risk may be considerably reduced when the country in question already chooses to integrate into an alliance like ALBA-TCP, which includes a country like Cuba.

i'm, in this year, writing my university dissertation about donations systems for opensource developers, focused more on the points you said, like bulk donations rather than individual donations.
i believe this can work in FLOSS development or other highly specific areas, not everything, so i dont believe for sure in the so-called market socialism.
my reasons for believing that approach can work in floss is that software development does not need tons of constant capital, it basically needs computers and internet access what everyone already has, doing developement or not.
you just need to cover the sallaries of open source developers, and my sollution of bulk donations would help normies to donate, they dont need to know especific people to donate (tough having this option is good too).
crypto doesnot work simply because is not a good currency. it takes too much time to do transactions, and as that cant be used to buy food (the most important point of donating). although i like the open source and flexibility to do bulk transfers from crypto.

>>20498
I really hope Lemmy posters ditch the training wheels and start posting on the microblog instances with hi charcounts and group posting. It's like forcing yourself to use a folder system instead of tags. Also, the upvotes thing is such a waste of time. Seeing moderators police it and bot vote counts is hilarious. Serious problem, some of the tenderqueer instances that are nominally "left unity" take this to an extreme, one anarchist reddit clone is literally just one guy and his sockpuppets, insanity. Never seen anything like that happen on Mastodon or Misskey forks.