/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

No no no OP you just don't understand, see?
MY changes to the methods and theories of Marxist-derived politics -> The immortal science of Marxism Leninism
YOUR changes to the methods and theories of Marxist-derived politics -> Revisionist shit, the satan incarnate, the enemy of the people, shredder of puppies

>>1808121
On a more serious note: The most generous good faith interpretation of the word revisionism is
>I do not agree that the evidence supports your rejection of previously established theories. I instead believe you enact these changes because you do not hold true to the Marxist goals of the liberation of the proletariat as a class, and are thus lying to advance other goals.

In regular use its just a slur people use for other people they disagree with.

>>1808114
Consider that the OG 'revisionist' was merely trying to align his party with the current reality. The SPD was tacking more and more toward reformism as it grew and gained political influence, despite its program calling for revolution. Bernstein's solution was to look at current trends and suggest that reformism could be fruitful as an alternative path to socialism.

>>1808138
and it turned out to end in the SPD
Next one pls

>>1808114
I'd split revisionism into two types:
Historical revisionism, which is twisting or revising history, usually for nefarious gains. We all now the perverted historical revisionism of american history in general.
The other being theoretical revisionism which I agree with OP here that challenging theory isn't a bad thing. I'd exclusively call revisionism when Marxist terms and concepts are misused, misinterpreted, or just completely overwritten. Like self proclaimed Marxists saying that Russia invading Ukraine is imperialism. In general, I don't have a big issue with people being revisionists, more so than with people having retarded antirevolutionary beliefs and praxis. Being perfectly in line with theory doesn't immediately yield a good outcome.

>>1808138
lol

>>1808138
Well, the retconning of your program to align with what you do, rather than aligning what you do with what your analysis and ideological frameworks tells you you ought to do, then claiming it will achieve the same thing, is in fact one of the rare instances of true revisionism.

They did not arrive at the strategy of reformism through analysis and statistics after deliberation. They wrote ideology to justify their behaviour.

China is proof that revisionism work

>>1808114
>People who think revsionism in Marxism means a dictionary definition of the word
Read the history of the Second International, morons

>>1808154
In this sense, Soviet revisionism (Khruschevism and what came after) makes a lot more sense as a post-facto retcon of stated doctrine to bring it in line with the behaviour that already existed (Stalinism)

I think you and all the other charlatans ITT have zero clue what revisionism actually is. lunch breaks over in a sec will explain in a bit

>>1808238
>I think you and all the other charlatans ITT have zero clue what revisionism actually is.
Just minimise the thread anon it's not worth it.

>>1808238
I'm back and would like to explain what revisionism is. There are many of these old words from 100 years ago which in contemporary usage may have a new meaning, I had the same issue a long time ago understanding this. OP, if you think that "revisionism" just means "revise" then you misunderstood the meaning of the term. That's not what revisionism means. Revisionism means, when you say for example, that a new event in reality means that Marx and Lenin were retrospectively wrong. That's what decisive about revisionism.

Kautsky and them lot were revisionist because they used a new development in history to liquidate and deny Marx's original discovery. They didn't simply say that we need to update Marx, which is what Lenin and Stalin did objectively. As you say, it is inherent to science to update the standard model and all of our therories. However, they just said that retrospectively Marx was actually wrong, and this was "proven" because the "worker revolution" never happened and because of the rise of the middle class. Lenin was the one who actually saved Marx's original discovery precisely by being heterodox, for example.

>>1808247
I think its actually worth it because OP has the same exact misunderstandings I had when I was a baby marxist 5 years ago.